[No. 10] Due to increased rate of installation of artificial turf fields, the disposal of artificial turf fields will become a greater nightmare as the world begins to retire in ever greater numbers the defective and old fields. According to an article in The Telegraph (12 September 2018), “[m]ajor new fears have emerged about the environmental toll of 3G pitches on generations to come, with a television documentary having revealed that there is no viable plan to recycle the huge numbers of surfaces the English Football Association is investing in heavily. The Dutch investigative programme Zembla discovered two enormous dumps of worn-out plastic pitches on the site of companies in Holland that were supposed to be recycling them. The English FA plans to build £200 million of 3G pitches in 30 towns and cities across football “hubs” over the next 10 years despite concerns over the possible effect of crumb rubber, the 20,000 shredded tyres used on each pitch as infill. The Telegraph has seen a tender put out on behalf of the FA, as well as the Rugby Football Union, England Hockey and Sport England in February 2016, to recycle 3G pitches in the United Kingdom which it is understood has not yet been awarded. The document says there is ‘a lack of a coherent approach for the recycling/re-use of old artificial grass pitches’ in the UK and that more than 150 will have to be replaced every year. There is only one recycling plant in Europe that can break down and purify the different elements of 3G pitches, located in Herning in Denmark. The operator, Re-Match, had hoped to build another plant in the UK but is yet to reach an agreement that would guarantee it the necessary supply of obsolete pitches to make the investment. In a statement, the FA said: ‘The FA, as a partner with other sporting governing bodies, has a contract in place with chosen providers and contractors to ensure that it is a legal requirement for all 3G pitches to be disposed of responsibly. We also request written statements and details from them about how this is done.' The FA is weighing up a £1 billion deal with Fulham owner Shahid Khan to sell Wembley Stadium, with the profits to be spent on grass-roots football, including the building of more 3G pitches. As well as unproven alleged links between rubber crumb and cancer, the Zembla investigation has discovered a disturbing environmental impact of 3G pitches beyond their useful life as surfaces on which to play sport. The average lifespan is around 10 years. The Zembla investigation ‘The Turf Mountain’ centred upon two Dutch companies, TUF and Vink, who removed 3G pitches which were found to have no long-term recycling plan and were stockpiling pitches in conditions dangerous to workers and the environment. Local authorities conceded they were fearful of shutting down the companies in question in case the cost of disposing safely of the stockpiles of obsolete pitches fell to them. The Telegraph spoke to one company in southern England which specialises in removing pitches and claims that it recycles all of the material it brings in. The old artificial turf is used in the manufacture of hanging baskets or is sold to golf clubs, farms and horse-riding centres for use as durable flooring. Even this re-use is a controversial subject with some arguing that under European Union law, the turf cannot be resold in its original form. The industry body, the European Synthetic Turf Organisation stipulating that when an artificial pitch ‘reaches the end of its service life it must be classified as a waste and any materials separated from the surface are also classified as waste until they have been fully recovered.’ One individual who asked not to be named working in the recycling of 3G pitches in the UK described it as a ‘massive issue’ and said that in the next two decades the problem ‘will escalate beyond belief.’ ‘Most surfaces will have to be relaid in the next 10 to 15 years and there will have to be a home for them. You cannot begin to imagine how much. You will be able to fill Wembley Stadium [with artificial turf].’ A Fifa report last year found that since 2006, 3.437 pitches had been certified with the world governing body in 149 countries. The UK and Holland were identified by Fifa among the most prolific installers of 3G pitches. Each 3G pitch weighs an average of around 220 tonnes and The Telegraph has learned of another site in southern England, which it has chosen not to identify, where around 25,000-30,000 tonnes of old artificial turf are being stored. Much of the artificial turf is in such a poor state that it cannot be reused in any form and that is thought to represent just a small part of the problem that the industry faces in the next few decades. Currently, it costs between £15,000 and £20,000 to roll up and remove a 3G pitch, including the cost of transporting it, with some recycling companies then selling it on at between £1-£2 per square metre if they can find a market.” Source: Sam Wallace, “Major new fears emerge over absence of recycling plan for 3G pitches,” in The Telegraph, 12 September 2018, at https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2018/09/12/major-new-fears-emerge-absence-recycling-plan-3g-pitches/ . The Zembla report can be seen at on You Tube at “ZEMBLA – The Artificial Turf Mountain” (Uploaded on 13 September 29018) at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5o3J7uy4Tk .
[No. 09] Beaumont, Texas – Used artificial turf destined for the municipal dump. According to a news item in the Beaumont Enterprise (2 August 2018), “[a] layer of black rubber pieces covered the dirt on the lot on Delaware Street and Renaud Avenue, where rolls of synthetic turf from Beaumont ISD's football field have lain for weeks. Curtis Jackson, 37, used a bobcat to lift one of the rolls, its ends dragging on the ground as he carried it across Renaud to a Dumpster waiting across the street. The small black rubber crumbs that fill the artificial turf poured out of each end of the roll as he lifted it into the blue bin, one of two he's ordered to haul off the material. Jackson, who said he was paid $7,000 by a broker to dispose of the turf, expects to pay about $10,000 to have it hauled to the dump. Beaumont ISD hired Hellas Construction to install new artificial turf at the ThomasCenter, which was completed on June 11. The company was supposed to haul off the old field, BISD spokeswoman Nakisha Burns said last month. The company hired a broker to take the turf, who then paid Jackson to dispose of it ‘however I thought necessary.’ Jackson, who owns a trucking company, Rhinoceros Global Enterprises, planned to store the turf on his father's property until a buyer came to pick it up. The sale fell through, he said, leaving the material to sit on the street corner while some came by to cut off pieces of it…. Curtis Jackson said he can fit about six or seven of the turf rolls in each Dumpster, which he is renting along with the Bobcat. The Dumpsters will be hauled to the city landfill and brought back for Jackson to fill again.” Source: Liz Teitz, “BISD turf headed for Beaumont dump,” in Beaumont Enterprise, 2 August 2018, at https://www.beaumontenterprise.com/news/article/BISD-turf-headed-for-Beaumont-dump-13127669.php
[No. 08] Montgomery County, Maryland – Disposal issues follow removal of RichardMontgomeryHigh School field material. According to a news report in The Almanac (7 August 2018), “[b]y With Montgomery County Public Schools replacing the first of its artificial fields this summer, disposal of the old material has been called into question. A copy of an email came to the Almanac a few weeks ago criticizing the removal and disposal of RichardMontgomeryHigh School artificial turf. … Kathleen Michels said she has been following the pros and cons of artificial turf for 10 years and has an arsenal of facts to use in making her case against its use in playing fields. Now that MCPS is at the point that it needs to replace some of the fields, more issues are involved. According to Michels in an email: ‘Turf Reclamation Solutions (TRS) President Mark Heinlein notes that per field: greater than 40,000 pounds of plastic per field and greater than 400,000 pounds of tire waste or other similar synthetic polymer infill per field go mostly to landfills (#1 on the infographic at right). A very little is burned (#2). A little is ‘repurposed’ (#3) as batting cage surfacing for example — but then goes to landfill. Wishful thinking on (#4) — recycling — as noted there — the removal must be carefully and expensively done with sorting of the infill separate from the plastic rug — but even then there is now no market to actually recycle back into synturf carpet (the preferred solution to save natural resources and trash) or into other plastic products.’ …. ‘Repurposing/reusing’ is purely a euphemism for dumping ... a mess of worn-out plastic carpet with literally tons of pulverized tire waste and sand spilling everywhere,” Michels wrote. ‘There really aren’t two sides to this story,” Michels said. “Do you really want to do this, take 40,000 pounds of plastic and [the rubber crumbs] and put them in a landfill? At this step, MCPS should say we made a mistake, this is the first one [of the fields to be recycled], Walter Johnson’s next up. This is a harbinger of things to come.’” Source: Peggy McEwan, “Artificial Turf’s Next Home?,” in The Almanac, 7 August 2018, at http://www.connectionnewspapers.com/news/2018/aug/07/artificial-turfs-next-home/
[No. 07] Montgomery County, Maryland – Another wrong way to dispose of artificial turf fields. According to an item in the Bethesda Magazine, (31 July 2018), replacement of the artificial turf at Richard Montgomery High has raised concerns. According to the item, the Richard Montgomery field was installed in 2008 at an estimated cost of around $1 million—with the turf itself costing about $450,000. “Montgomery County Public Schools started the work of removing the artificial turf field at RichardMontgomeryHigh School earlier this month [July] —and immediately attracted criticism from the Parents’ Coalition of Montgomery County [ htpp://parentscoalitionmc.blogspost.com ] … “The old turf system, including the fibers and rubber infill pellets, was to be repurposed as a ‘continuation of the overall lifecycle’ of the materials, MCPS [Montgomery County Public Schools] Chief Operating Officer Andrew Zuckerman told the school community in an email announcing the start of the work July 21. But members of the Parents’ Coalition [ , a local advocacy group, who have been going to the school to watch over the removal and transport, have questioned whether the materials were being recycled or tossed out, posting photos of rolls of turf in dumpsters and piles of plastic pellets on pavement to the group’s website and social media accounts. In a Monday [July 30] blog post, the coalition shared photos of three dumpsters at the school property in Rockville and alleged that 12 tons of artificial turf had been sent to a landfill in Brunswick, Virginia. The post said that the dumpsters were evidence that the artificial turf was being thrown out instead of recycled. The Coalitin shared the following three pictures with SynTurf.org.
“Superintendent Jack Smith asked Zuckerman to read a statement at Monday's school board meeting to address the concerns. Zuckerman said the board had received additional questions over the weekend about the disposal of the material, reiterated that the field would be reused, and said officials would create a full, written explanation of the removal process as requested by board member Jill Ortman-Fouse, who posed a series of questions to Smith in a memorandum. ‘Consistent with the clear policy direction of the Board of Education and consistent with the MCPS value of environmental stewardship, our contract for replacement of the RMHS field included a requirement that the existing field be recycled to the maximum extent possible,’ Zuckerman’s statement said. ‘In this case, the entire field system, which includes the carpet and infill material, is being reused by a recreational facility in the White Marsh area and others outside of Maryland. Reuse is a core element of the ‘Reduce, Reuse, Recycle’ approach to waste management. Product reuse is permissible under state and local regulations; prevents materials from being disposed of in the waste stream; and precludes the need for additional new materials to be generated. Zuckerman also said that ‘a very small fraction” of debris from the full field was cleared and transported to a waste transfer station, where it will be sorted for recycling or disposal.’ ”Source: Danielle E. Gaines, “School officials discuss issue; board approves funding for B-CC field,” in Bethesda Magazine, 31 July, 2018, at http://www.bethesdamagazine.com/Bethesda-Beat/2018/Replacement-of-Artificial-Turf-Raises-Concerns-at-Richard-Montgomery-High/#.W2G4IGpOcss.blogger
[No. 06] Beaumont, Texas – How not to dispose of artificial turf fields! According to a news item in the Beaumont Enterprise (3 July 29018), “[a] large pile of synthetic turf from the The Carrol A. "Butch" ThomasEducationalSupportCenter was recently discovered on an empty lot at the corner of Delaware Street and Renaud Avenue. A district spokesperson said the turf was to be disposed of properly by contractors and that complaints calls have been made to the contracting company. Less than a month after its removal from the ThomasCenter, the remnants of Beaumont ISD's old artificial turf football field [sat] rolled up in an empty residential lot in North Beaumont. The turf field was not supposed to end up at the lot….”
[No. 05] Current theory and practice of dealing with used artificial turf fields. First, an explanatory word about the underlined segment of the title to this piece. It would have been easy to title this piece “Current theory and practice of disposal of artificial turf fields.” The problem with using the term “disposal” is that it does not convey completely the breadth of what happens to artificial turf fields once they are removed from a particular location. The term, “disposal” would commonly mean that the plastic carpet, backing, underlay and the infill are thrown away as waste, making room for a new surface. While the “owner” of the field subjectively may call the activity “disposal,” the fact remains that a worn or removed field objectively may not be at the end of its life. There are plenty of stories about how a venue takes out its field and donates it to another venue/user. Just recently we posted a story about one such “hand-me down” scenario. See “Tale of Two Sites: Poor Management in Las Vegas & Embarrassment of Riches in Portland” at http://www.synturf.org/maintenancereplacement.html (Item No. 109). We reserve judgment on the wisdom of passing down or receiving a product that obviously is no longer fit for use, but some poor organization or neighborhood considers it a blessing to receive it.
Thanks to the folks at the Safe Healthy Playing Fields Coalition (http://www.safehealthyplayingfields.org/ ) and the Environment and Human Health, Inc. (www.ehhi.org), in May 2016 we received a correspondence thread about disposal protocols for artificial turf fields. With thanks to one particular “Sheldon” for digging up some links to industry literature on the issue, here is what we gleaned from the rest of the contents.
According to an article published in Recreation Management Magazine - “’A typical field is about 600,000 pounds of material. In 2011, 180 fields were removed in the United States, and 90 percent of those went into a landfill,’ said Mark Mitchell, president and owner of Mitchell Machine Works, which specializes in design-build machinery for the manufacture, installation and removal of synthetic turf. ‘In 2012, an anticipated 250 to 300 fields will be removed. In 2013, the number jumps again with approximately 500 to 700 fields being removed.’ … ‘The field doesn't need to be thrown away, there are just too many millions of pounds going into landfill,’ Mitchell said. ‘The specifiers and the turf managers can mandate what is to happen to the fields. That is what will be the driving force of the fields being recycled.’”
“The artificial turf fields that were initially installed [circa 2005] had a life span of eight to 10 years. That means the number of fields that are coming up per year for replacement is increasing. ‘In the next five years and on into the future, we are going to see a lot of municipalities and institutions that need to replace their synthetic turf fields and infill,’ said Mark Novak, Stantec consulting SportGroup leader for the United States and Canada, focusing on the design of athletic and recreational facilities. ‘These fields typically had eight-year warranties. In some cases, they were originally installed a decade or more ago, and they have fulfilled their useful lifespan.’ At the same time the number of fields needing to be replaced is increasing, there is also a high level of interest in being environmentally responsible with what happens to the old fields. This emerging trend of figuring out how to best recycle the various components of the field is something every field manager should be concerned with because it affects the costs associated with replacing the artificial turf field.”
According to the Recreation Management Magazine article some manufacturers “utilize reclaimed material for energy production by using the turf fibers as a fuel. This is also known as a waste-to-energy plant where the various waste components are burned to create electrical energy. Another way the turf is recycled is for the turf system to be converted back into the resin/polymer state and then molded or extruded into new products such as carpet backing, mats, rugs and sheet goods. This reduces the demand for virgin materials.” Tammy York, “Greener Grass Awaits: Environmental & Fiscal Responsibility Team Up in Synthetic Turf” at http://recmanagement.com/feature_print.php?fid=201202fe02 . Seehere for the pdf version of the article.
All this gives us at SynTurf.org the (mis)impression that the artificial turf industry is being very aggressive in manufacturing products that are more sustainable and can be repurposed. The fact of the matter is that the industry is interested in installation (sales) of these fields where the big profits lie and is in the least interested in what to do with the playing surfaces that are removed – that is someone else’s headache. While these repurposing solutions theoretically lower the demand for virgin material, the fact is that the virgin material is cheaper to obtain and manufacture, which is only helpful to the industry’s bottom line. While the Synthetic Turf Council, according to the article, “has created an end of life task force to educate the public about the advances that have been made and what to look for in the future,” let us not lose sight of the fact that this sort of “environmental conscientiousness” on the part of the industry is just a marketing ploy to make the sale—a perfunctory addressing of the issue of disposal because it is being raised at the municipal level by concerned citizens. Not until the cost of land-filling or incinerating the useless artificial turf material reaches a critical level for the industry will we see a genuine move by the market to finance and develop environmentally sound repurposing and disposal for the material.
The website of Turf Reclamation Solution (TRS) contains two article of note: One is an overview from the perspective of TRS President Mark Heinlein; it is at once informative and alarming: “The number of synthetic turf fields reaching their end-of-life in the U.S. is exploding. By 2018, more than 1,000 fields will need to be replaced every year – every year for decades to come. This means that each year nearly 100 million square feet of turf and half a billion pounds of sand/rubber infill will need to find a new home. If destined for the landfill, it is a staggering amount of waste. If not the landfill, then what? First, let’s talk turf. There are several opportunities for diverting synthetic turf from the landfill following its sports field days. One option is that the material is re-used, or repurposed. Common re-uses include batting cage surfaces, dog runs, or even reinstallation for low level rec surfaces. A second, and more sustainable option, is processing the turf into feedstock for the plastic molding industry. This includes a huge array of molded plastic parts, as well as things like plasticized lumber, plastic pallets, flooring, and non-critical auto parts, just to name a few examples. Taking turf from the field and returning it to commerce as a new plastic good is referred to as ‘down-cycling’ and is an affordable, sustainable, and environmentally responsible practice.”
Here is the alarming stuff: “Now what about the existing sand/rubber infill? There are plenty of alternative uses for this material after it has served its purpose in the field. There is equipment available that can extract essentially all of the infill out of the old carpet right on site, making it available for installation back into the new field. It can also be used for topdressing natural grass fields or be blended into garden soil mixes. If the infill components can be separated from each other, the potential uses increase dramatically because you now have discrete products with a wide range of applications.” (Emphasis added). Source: Sarah Shewmaker, “President of TRS Spreads the Word on What Happens to Used Turf,” June 19, 2014, at http://www.recyclingartificialturf.com/tags/landfill . Seehere for the pdf of the article.
The other article on TRS’s website discusses the end-of-life scenarios for artificial turf fields. These are:
“Landfill. This is the simplest and most common way to handle the synthetic turf waste stream. Even though it’s the easiest thing to do, it’s not always the most cost effective. While landfill costs in the Midwest average around $10,000, it could cost 5 times that amount on the East and West Coasts. And after the material hits the dump, it’s a lost resource.”
“Waste to Energy. This approach takes the synthetic turf and incinerates it at a high temperature, extracting the BTUs (energy trapped in the product). This energy is then used to heat a boiler and generate electricity. Some amount of residential carpet is handled in this way via the Carpet America Recovery Effort. In a WTE process, the volume of material is typically reduced by 95% while big, powerful scrubbers extract hazardous by-products and ensure that emissions meet strict air quality standards. Critics argue that WTE destroys valuable resources and releases excessive CO2.”
“Repurposing (Reusing). This solution takes a piece of turf that was deemed useless in one application and finds use for it in another (a batting cage, for example). While a good short-term solution, the reality is that once the field is divvied up into smaller pieces, the chances for recycling are greatly reduced. The other stark reality is that the repurposed market will soon be flooded with product – about 1,000 synthetic turf fields will be removed in 2016. That’s over 80 million square feet of old turf.”
“Recycling. This is the ultimate solution, turning seemingly useless waste into useful plastic goods. These goods can continue to be recycled, creating a closed loop, allow resources to be reused (and not mined) and perpetually delay their trip to the landfill. This is arguably the most difficult solution as it requires specialized machinery to remove and separate the field, and some advanced chemistry to make polyethylene, polypropylene, polyurethane, polyester and/or nylon compatible. TRS can bring all of that together in a turnkey process and once this is done, the applications for molded plastic goods that are only limited by imagination. This option has the best chance for long-term sustainability.” Source: Adam Coleman, “What Happens to Used Turf? Lifecycle Options for Synthetic Turf,” 1 October 2013, at http://www.recyclingartificialturf.com/tags/landfill . Seehere for pdf of the article.
In practice, however, we have come to learn that artificial turf fields are treated as regular household garbage, even though it has materials associated with it that one cannot dispose of in normal household a trash destined for the landfill!
Alan Pultyniewicz is Recycling Coordinator for Montgomery County [Maryland] Department of Environmental Protection’s Division of Solid Waste Services. According to an email from him to a member of the Safe Healthy Playing Fields Coalition, dated 14 October 2015, based on consultation with Peter Karasik, Chief of the Central Operations Section of the Division of Solid Waste Services, who oversees the Montgomery County Shady Grove Processing Facility and Transfer Station, “[s]ynthetic ‘artificial’ turf is not a regulated waste, and therefore is managed as municipal solid waste in Montgomery County. If any synthetic “artificial” turf is disposed of in the county’s solid waste stream, the material is loaded out through the compactors at the Transfer Station and is sent to the Resource Recovery Facility (RRF) for processing. A large amount of synthetic turf - in bulk or in large sections, delivered to the Transfer Station could potentially jam the compactors at the Transfer Station or the feed chutes at the RRF, resulting in manageable operational issues. Other than that, synthetic turf is not an issue in regards to the County’s solid waste management system.”
As ascertained by the Environment and Human Health, Inc. the protocol for disposing of synthetic turf fields in Connecticut according to the Director of Waste Engineering and Enforcement Division Bureau of Materials Management and Compliance Assurance at the Connecticut Department of Energy and Environmental Protection (CT DEEP) is as follows: (1) a permit from the CT DEEP is needed to dispose a synthetic turf field; (2) the old synthetic turf field will be land filled somewhere - not in Connecticut - as there is not enough room left in state’s landfills; (3) the costs of disposing the old synthetic turf field will include: (a) transportation costs to a designated out-of-state landfill; (b) paying the landfill itself to take the old synthetic turf field (the actual cost is set by market conditions of waste supply and compliance with operating permits).
[No. 04] Vicinity of Olympic Park, Schaumburg, Illinois -- Shameful if not illegal discard/disposal/dumping of crumb rubber and worn synthetic turf material in Water District area. The following pictures tell all that one needs to know about the irresponsible if not illegal conduct of whoever thought it was a good idea to dump bagfuls of crumb rubber and discarded stretches of synthetic grass material in the area of close to Schaumburg Water Reclamation District. In this short link to the Google Map at https://goo.gl/maps/GSeWWU6K9Yt the pile of synthetic turf rolls is clearly visible. We are grateful to Robert Dixon of Riverside, Illinois, a concerned parent and of 10-year old soccer goalie, for this item and the pictures. Material received on 21 March 2016. Posted on 1 April 2016.
[No. 03] Removing an artificial turf surface. Ever wondered how an artificial turf field is taken up? Here is a video of machinery at work. Notice that none of the folks manning these machines is wearing protective gear! Is this just an oversight, OSHA exemption, or a ploy to impress the public about zero-health hazard of inhaling harmful material like rubber dust and sand during the removal process? Check it out at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eWlf9Kc3Gc&feature=youtu.be (published on 19 January 2016). In order to see what we are talking about see this one for what blows in the wind https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zIGvSzIrWI (published on 20 May 2010).
[No. 02] Middletown, New Jersey: Town plans to dispose of old turf in garbage.According to a report in The Independent (October 2, 2008), the turf field at Middletown High School North “is currently being cut up, and the only place the turf would go … into the garbage.” “The turf is going to dumpsters,” said Board of Education Attorney Christopher Parton. According to Parton, the contractor cuts the field into a checkerboard and remove the square panels. “Our original plan was to roll it up and do whatever,” he said. When the contractor has been directed to remove the turf, it “tried a theory of vacuuming all of the ambient rubber out and rolling up the turf; that did not work,” said Parton. The removal of he field is being necessitated because the first installer, Mondo USA’s failed to come back and fix work done on the field. Source: Jamir Romm, “Turft hits the curb at H.S. North,” in The Independent (Freehold, New Jersey), October 2, 2008, available at t is http://independent.gmnews.com/news/2008/1002/front_page/009.html .
[No. 01] Where do dead turf fields go?SynTurf.org, Newton, Mass. October 3, 2008. In Massachusetts and many other states, used tires are handled as hazardous waste, subject to special handling by the municipal and state solid waste management system. No used tire is supposed to end up in regular garbage. Here, as in many other parts of the country, an enlightened citizenry supposed to spare the landfills of plastics and other non-biodegradable items that can be recycled.
Most artificial turf fields in the United States contains 100 tons of crumb rubber, most of which is made of used tires – 22,000 used tires are processed to yield 100 tons of crumb rubber. The carpet itself and the geo-textile that supports it are made of a variety of plastics and nylons. Then why is it that the turf industry and municipal, state and federal authorities are looking the other way when hundreds of tons crumb rubber – with all of its toxic substances – and thousands upon thousands of square yards of artificial turf carpets are being disposed off in our nation’s regular landfills?
In five to six years, when the currently in-use artificial turf fields are due to be replaced, the disposal of old fields and its toxic infill will swamp our landfills in a volume that, under current handling procedures, will overwhelm the solid waste management system. The current disposal of artificial turf fields and rubber infill is fraught with environmental and health hazards. One can only imagine the potential for harm when thousands of fields are ripped out and taken to landfills, from which the leachate, particulates and off-gassedharmful substances can make its way into soil, air and water.
The time for regulating the environmentally-safe disposal of artificial turf, or its recycling, is now. Six years from now, it will be too late.